Nice summary of these three visions of dystopia. I believe the answer to the question "Which one is it?" is that we are living in a hybrid dystopia. All three, and then some.
The interesting thing about 1984 is that there is an underclass who seem to be living perfectly normal lives. Maybe I missed something when I read it years ago but I remember being surprised that it was only what appeared to be the intelligensia or middle-class who were living in this scary surveillance state. What were presumably the cleaners, dustbin men, plumbers and bakers all seemed to be drinking down the "Dog & Duck", eating chips and living an unobserved working class life.
Huxley also had a sort of underclass living outside the world of happy drug-takers who also lived apparently normal lives.
If you are not a middle-class, educated, professional type the state doesn't seem interested in controlling you. This seems true in dystopian novels and in real life.
Orwell's proles are left largely alone presumably because they pose no threat to the establishment. They're living in a sort of stupor of consumption, similar in a sense to those in the other novels.
Such people need not be controlled by the Party, but merely distracted — definitely a warning in there for modern times, and a pattern seen throughout history...
Staying under the radar is a good strategy. But then as soon as you want to do anything--publish a book, travel, start a business, you pop back up on the radar screen. It helps to move to a non-Five Eyes country.
In her introduction to The Handmaid’s Tale, Atwood writes that Gilead is essentially an amalgamation of real things that governments across the world have done. Interesting to think about America today as the reverse- a hodgepodge of dystopias rolled into one. Personally, I wish we had some of the good stuff. If we must suffer the surveillance and antiintellectualism, can’t we have a little advanced medicine as a treat?
I’d add the Parable of the Sower to this list. When I was reading it, I was shocked at how much Butler got right about the 2020s.
We're definitely in Fahrenheit 451. Intellectuals are hounded by social media bots in X, etc. and people prefer shallow entertainment (Superbowl etc.) to the discomfort of complex ideas (Israel Palestine).
And to think many prefer the cheap pleasures found on social media more than they do those provided by their spouse! We see technology dividing the household just as it does in Fahrenheit 451.
Like other comments, the combination of various elements makes sense. Ultimately, I'm with Neil Postman on this:
"What Huxley teaches is that in the age of advanced technology, spiritual devastation is more likely to come from an enemy with a smiling face than from one whose countenance exudes suspicion and hate. In the Huxleyan prophecy, Big Brother does not watch us, by his choice. We watch him, by ours" (Amusing Ourselves to Death, 155).
We are living in the conflation of the three now. Hopefully, we are awakening to this dystopian hell to their self-inflicted delusion and slavery to darkness . The irony is that those "in power" are victims themselves, and will be the last to awaken to the light of God's truth.
Two other stories worth noting, Logan's Run, where the people are duped into believing they go through a ritual of "ascension" at age 30, and Ayn Rand's novella, "Anthem," about a collectivist society where thinking for oneself is outlawed.
Have you thought about adding “planet of the apes” to your dystopias?
In the book the transition from human to ape society began when people became too lazy to read or undertake difficult tasks, allowing apes to bootstrap themselves into dominance.
(Is it obvious why this has not been used in movies?)
It’s sort of a mix of Brave New World (self stupification) and replacement theory. Are its “apes” a metaphor for AI*or another (formerly backward) civilization.
It ends with the former rulers enslaved, experimented upon, and hunted for sport, little better than Eloi. That’s dystopian.
* “once you allowed us to do your thinking for you, it really became our civilization “ applies to Planet of the Apes.
Emerald Robinson has a great Venn diagram on her latest substack post, Favorite Memes of the Biden Era https://substack.com/home/post/p-154306889, including these three and several others (The Matrix, Lord of the Flies, Mad Max, Hunger Games and more). 1984, fear-based oppression, was the pandemic; Fahrenheit 451 was the censorship industrial complex; Brave New World is Hollywood.
I agree with the hybrid of all 3. I'd throw in a potential/eventual Handmaid's Tale with the Dobbs ruling , extreme misogyny , climate crisis denial, & the attempts to no longer have separation of church & state in our schools.
Montag in Fahrenheit 451 becomes The Book of Ecclesiastes. This is ultimately the bigger message. Ai “explores the meaning of life and the limits of human achievement, often through the perspective of a skeptical "teacher". The book's central theme is the concept of "hevel," meaning temporary or fleeting, suggesting that much of human endeavor is ultimately vain. “
Nice summary of these three visions of dystopia. I believe the answer to the question "Which one is it?" is that we are living in a hybrid dystopia. All three, and then some.
Thanks John! You and I certainly agree on that — "All three, and then some."
The interesting thing about 1984 is that there is an underclass who seem to be living perfectly normal lives. Maybe I missed something when I read it years ago but I remember being surprised that it was only what appeared to be the intelligensia or middle-class who were living in this scary surveillance state. What were presumably the cleaners, dustbin men, plumbers and bakers all seemed to be drinking down the "Dog & Duck", eating chips and living an unobserved working class life.
Huxley also had a sort of underclass living outside the world of happy drug-takers who also lived apparently normal lives.
If you are not a middle-class, educated, professional type the state doesn't seem interested in controlling you. This seems true in dystopian novels and in real life.
Orwell's proles are left largely alone presumably because they pose no threat to the establishment. They're living in a sort of stupor of consumption, similar in a sense to those in the other novels.
Such people need not be controlled by the Party, but merely distracted — definitely a warning in there for modern times, and a pattern seen throughout history...
How long until we’re all Morlocks and Elloi?
Excellent point. The regime cares primarily to control those who pose a threat to its existence
Staying under the radar is a good strategy. But then as soon as you want to do anything--publish a book, travel, start a business, you pop back up on the radar screen. It helps to move to a non-Five Eyes country.
🎯
The Machine Stops is the ultimate dystopian depiction. Read it now, it's only a short story.
In her introduction to The Handmaid’s Tale, Atwood writes that Gilead is essentially an amalgamation of real things that governments across the world have done. Interesting to think about America today as the reverse- a hodgepodge of dystopias rolled into one. Personally, I wish we had some of the good stuff. If we must suffer the surveillance and antiintellectualism, can’t we have a little advanced medicine as a treat?
I’d add the Parable of the Sower to this list. When I was reading it, I was shocked at how much Butler got right about the 2020s.
That’s a great recommendation…. Thanks
We're definitely in Fahrenheit 451. Intellectuals are hounded by social media bots in X, etc. and people prefer shallow entertainment (Superbowl etc.) to the discomfort of complex ideas (Israel Palestine).
And to think many prefer the cheap pleasures found on social media more than they do those provided by their spouse! We see technology dividing the household just as it does in Fahrenheit 451.
Like other comments, the combination of various elements makes sense. Ultimately, I'm with Neil Postman on this:
"What Huxley teaches is that in the age of advanced technology, spiritual devastation is more likely to come from an enemy with a smiling face than from one whose countenance exudes suspicion and hate. In the Huxleyan prophecy, Big Brother does not watch us, by his choice. We watch him, by ours" (Amusing Ourselves to Death, 155).
I agree on the hybrid dystopia, we are literally living in a world where fear, desire, and distraction are visible on every step.
We are living in the conflation of the three now. Hopefully, we are awakening to this dystopian hell to their self-inflicted delusion and slavery to darkness . The irony is that those "in power" are victims themselves, and will be the last to awaken to the light of God's truth.
I fear "all of the above." To paraphrase Picard, I'll be trying to "Make it not so."
Problem, books may have been read but no one seems to have understood what they meant or feared what was read.
As Andre Gide noted: Everything has already been said. But no one was listening, so everything must be said again.
Omitting those who have used them as instruction manuals…
Perhaps the leadership should be better read….
Two other stories worth noting, Logan's Run, where the people are duped into believing they go through a ritual of "ascension" at age 30, and Ayn Rand's novella, "Anthem," about a collectivist society where thinking for oneself is outlawed.
Have you thought about adding “planet of the apes” to your dystopias?
In the book the transition from human to ape society began when people became too lazy to read or undertake difficult tasks, allowing apes to bootstrap themselves into dominance.
(Is it obvious why this has not been used in movies?)
It’s sort of a mix of Brave New World (self stupification) and replacement theory. Are its “apes” a metaphor for AI*or another (formerly backward) civilization.
It ends with the former rulers enslaved, experimented upon, and hunted for sport, little better than Eloi. That’s dystopian.
* “once you allowed us to do your thinking for you, it really became our civilization “ applies to Planet of the Apes.
Emerald Robinson has a great Venn diagram on her latest substack post, Favorite Memes of the Biden Era https://substack.com/home/post/p-154306889, including these three and several others (The Matrix, Lord of the Flies, Mad Max, Hunger Games and more). 1984, fear-based oppression, was the pandemic; Fahrenheit 451 was the censorship industrial complex; Brave New World is Hollywood.
I agree with the hybrid of all 3. I'd throw in a potential/eventual Handmaid's Tale with the Dobbs ruling , extreme misogyny , climate crisis denial, & the attempts to no longer have separation of church & state in our schools.
I think this is what you're looking for:
https://ih1.redbubble.net/image.3449079053.9436/poster,504x498,f8f8f8-pad,600x600,f8f8f8.jpg
We're in all of them simultaneously.
Montag in Fahrenheit 451 becomes The Book of Ecclesiastes. This is ultimately the bigger message. Ai “explores the meaning of life and the limits of human achievement, often through the perspective of a skeptical "teacher". The book's central theme is the concept of "hevel," meaning temporary or fleeting, suggesting that much of human endeavor is ultimately vain. “